Thanks for your response Ian.
You response is an example of why the left has caused totally unnecessary splits in the national movement by insisting that anybody who wishes to join Plaid has to sign up to socialism. Something which I am unable, in conscious, to do.
I gave my full support to the workers at Friction Dynamic, not because I saw the issue as a right / left issue, but because I saw it from my right wing chapel mentality as a right / wrong issue.
During the miner's strike, a fight between English ideologists, where both sides were wrong and neither could give a bugger about what was best for Wales, I (obviously) supported the Welsh miners, and I did so along side the Mersyside branch of the Socialist Workers Party, because they were the only people who remembered that there were coal mines in north Wales not just in the south.
The silly point is that Liverpool's Trots welcomed my support, despite the fact that they knew that I was both a right winger and a Welsh Nat. Plaid, on the other hand, rejects my support because I am not a leftist.
As to your comment that I have little or no understanding of the internal politics of Plaid. I was a member of Plaid before you were born, Ian bach, I probably have a better understanding of Plaid's internal politics than you will ever have.
When the late great Bob Skillicorn started Plaid's Trade Union section I was chair of NUPE in Gwynedd, one of the founders of Plaid's Trade Union Section.
NUPE, was one of the most bolshie left wing unions at the time, but they were happy to have a right wing nat as chair in Gwynedd!
Despite my right wing credentials I have worked with left wingers of all sorts to advance the common cause, the ONLY left wingers who refuse to accept that I can have common cause with them are Plaid Cymru's socialist tendency.
The saddest thing about Palid's silly lefties is that their socialism is all so BRIT, it never has anything to do with Wales!
You make the snide comment that I can be a Tory in a self-governing Wales. As a Welsh Nationalist, [you] look forward to that day. Whilst you and yours prohibit non socialists from playing a full part in the national cause you are not looking forward to that day, you are preventing that day from dawning!
Normal Mouth is censoring posts now.
ReplyDeleteGuess what? There people in Plaid who do not use the word socialist and still stay members. What is your hang up about the so called lefties in Plaid? What you have not answered is point I repeat.
ReplyDeletePlaid is very decentralised and allows members to set policy at conference and National Council. If the members genuinely wanted to move the party to the right, they have every opportunity to do so. They do not becuase the majority are content with the existing policy agenda, which is not hard left as you suggest. Nothing you have said has countered this basic reality. To state the 'lefties' in Plaid are from the Brit mould yet again exposes your lack of knowledge of the party. I don't care how long you were a member, because frankly, you are way out of touch.
what a pity they don't have to sign up to independence
ReplyDeleteanon - you could argue like the advert 'that if Plaid Cymru did Nationalism it would be the best Nationalism in the world :)
ReplyDeleteian, MOF is allowed his views if you or the others in Plaid Cymru object start your own blog to counter the arguments.
to the other anon NM always did sensor and not allow anon comments when he started he's just reverting to type, quite ironic after calling someone who posted a comment a precious little flower on his latest post.
NM,well he's been Golwged thats the trouble,pity but there u go.
ReplyDeleteI thought Plaid was a broad church that could encompass all views left right and centre. But if you are not comfortable with that flexi model, its best to get out and not cause problems. Thats what my mam always taught me anyway.
Ian look at your Plaid membership card!
ReplyDeleteOnly Socialists can join!
I am not a socialist, I hate socialism, socialism has destroyed Welsh identity, stopped Welsh entrepreneurship, split communities, degraded the Welsh language and shit on Wales in every way shape and form for the last hundred years.
I have principals, I will not join a socialist party.
The claim that Plaid is some sort of Broad Church/ Inter-faith Community that allows membership from all is a lie. The card says, quite clearly, that non socialists (like me) are not allowed within a hair's breadth of the party any more.
Of course I could lie, and be a pretend socialist (like Tony Blair). Does Plaid need a Tony Blair?
what exactly does it say on the card? and if you are really right wing, why not join the tories, who are going to win the next election anyway?
ReplyDeleteYou're quite right of course Alwyn, socialism is a continuing disaster for Wales. Join the Tories? Why on earth should a patriotic Welshman join a foreign party.
ReplyDeletebecause lots of patriotic welsh men and women already are members.
ReplyDeleteNo doubt a lot of patriotic Welsh folk are in the Tory party, trouble is they're British patriots first and foremost.
ReplyDeleteOut of interest Alwyn, what membership card are you talking about?
ReplyDeleteThe Plaid card reads as follows on the front-
Plaid Cymru
Aeldoaeth 2008/Membership 2008
www.plaidcymru.org (and the postal address)
and on the back-
Ein dyfodol/For all our futures (party motto for the year)
Name
Signature
Membership Number
What is the problem exactly?