Anybody who has ever read this blog will know that Ms Wood and I are poles apart politically.
I won't bother to go into specifics, because a simple Google search can do a better job, and a Google search will show, without doubt, that Ms Wood and I are not bedfellows – by a long, long, long way!
I'm a right winger; Leanne is very much to my antipathy –she's a horrid lefty!
I hate left wing politics in my belly, my heart and my brain, but there is a warmth in all my organs that burns warmer than left v right and that is the fire for Welsh independence
The only person who is four square on independence in the Plaid leadership poll is Leanne.
I am almost tempted to re-join the party and start a Hydro for Leanne group – in order to to embarrass her! (Note for youngsters: Hydro was the right wing group in Plaid before you or Ms Wood were even born)
Let there be no doubt, I will oppose Leanne's leftism, but at least I will have a principal to oppose if Leanne is elected party leader, rather than the wishy washy nothing that the other candidates seem to be offering.
And in real politics, Plaid has had a leader to ignore for the last 10 years.
Leanne's strength is you can love her or hate her but you cannot ignore her!
And Plaid's problem over recent years is that it has been ignored!
Just try to ignore Ms Wood at your peril!
Probably quite a few would re-join if there was a centre right grouping within Plaid Cymru. Brian Morgan Edwards and the Hydro Group seems to be a long time ago.
ReplyDeleteIt would be a sign of appalling political judgement if the centrist minority in Plaid were to set up an internal faction. Our opponents would easily be able to say to the people of Wales that we were split and unsure of the kind of party we are. Im simply unaware of anything good ever coming from this "nationalist centre right" that we hear so much about online but never see a peep of in the real world, since the 60s and 70s in any case. I'm beginning to think it's people outside the party pushing this strange line.
DeleteWith that said, if the media and political system on Wales were more advanced a separate conservative nationalist party would enrich Wales as a democracy. It would have to be a separate party to Plaid because Plaid is a decentralist socialist party and the new party review reaffirms that fact.
I rejoined Plaid because there was one leadership candidate who was not ambivalent about independence. I also believe that she presents a set of political beliefs that could win the hearts and minds of the bulk of the country and so is most likely to win most votes for Plaid and thus for an independent Wales.
ReplyDeleteI’m lucky enough to hold similar political views to her and so there is no dilemma for me. I believe it is better to be inside the tent rather than outside, so as to speak.
Were I to be you I would rejoin. If nothing else the debates could be interesting to say the least, and with a bigger audience.
Unless I’m mistaken I’m a little older than you and I have vague memories of Hydra and a journal called Tonnau. But that was in the dim and distant past....
Cytuno cant y cant Miserable. I'm of the same persuasion as you but come to the same conclusion.
ReplyDeleteLeanne is a risk but chosing one of the other 3 is a bigger risk.
Plaid's had 12 years of managerialism, don't rock the boat, don't say anything vaguely contentious (except on bloody Iraq over which we have no power ... which, of course is the reason Plaid's lefties could crow so much about).
In any case, Leanne will not go quietly into the night. Right now, Plaid and Welsh nationalism needs a fighter, and Leanne is a fighter. She's also no nonsense on Welsh independence. I'm a nationalist first. She's got my (right-wing) vote.
I think Borthlas draws the distinction between Conviction politicians and those that tell you what you want to hear. Unlike you MOF I do back the Social values that Leanne represents and am reassured that her honest pursuit of Independence reassures you enough to back her.
ReplyDeleteI do think Plaid's demise is due to the weak messages issued with regards to Independence. Plaid is the national party of Wales and therefore very different to the other parties which are British parties with "regional representation" in Wales.
I honestly believe that people like DET and others have misread the lessons of the past. The SNP have stuck to their guns and principles and made the breakthrough. I do not believe there is a huge difference in the situation in Scotland and Wales except that Scotland's journey to freedom is at a more advanced stage.
I have no doubt that Leanne will enable Plaid to break through in Anglicised areas like the valleys and thus like the SNP into power.
Better a politician who possesses clear beliefs. There is so little of that in politics these days. Its all so wishy-washy, and all most of them seem to be concerned with is their re-election (and their expense accounts). Vote for her or not, but at least admire the lady's convictions.
ReplyDeletePeople in Plaid or nationalism that are 'centre-right' tend to be more liberal than Conservative. In that way they share some values with Leanne Wood on the importance of a sense of localism and tradition, even though Leanne Wood is a dyed-in-the-wool socialist rather than a liberal. There is at least some cross over with her views and the Blaid's generally. I have a feeling that electing Leanne Wood will get Plaid noticed. Plaid is the third party now, like it or not. They aren't in the SNP's position of having to fight and win an existential referendum. The time now is suited to putting across arguments and shaking Wales up.
ReplyDeleteRegardless of this argument though, the contest itself has come across quite well if I may say so. The contenders seem very dignified and supportive of each other. There is a dignity and importance about the contest and what is left of the Welsh media seems to be paying it due respect, knowing as they do the centrality that the party of Wales has to the nation's development. I am biased but I think the calibre of all four is way ahead of Carwyn Jones' opponents or the Conservative group leadership 'contest'.
Plaid Gwersyllt advocating a right wing group n Plaid? must be some sort of stalinist trick, everyone knows he's part of the looney left
ReplyDeleteLeft libertarian actually!
ReplyDeleteWe are a broad based party and should welcome all who believe in independence and shouldn't be restricted to just economic and social values.
Anon 23/01/2012 22:24; If you think that Arfon is a part of the Stalinist loony left you may as well accuse me of being a Trotskyite! Arfon may well be to the left of Welsh Labour, but so are Gutto Bebb and John Buffton!
ReplyDeleteAlwyn, if i han't been sitting down
ReplyDeletewhen i read this i'd have fallen over mate 8-)great stuff, UNITY IS STRENGTH!!
Personally i've always assumed that the centre right would form their own party when Cymru had reached a certain stage in it's progression but only after the one aim we all hold to our hearts is nearing completion.
Elyboy.
Chwarae teg. Certainly like all parties Plaid has a spectrum of opinion. Also it's wise not just to vote on politics alone. Skills such as engaging with people, communicating well and being hard working also come into play.
ReplyDeleteAlso agree with the comments above about Leanne's politics. Yes, she is a socialist. But in addition, she is a liberal and believes in the power of communities and local democracy.
I think Leanne has managed to reach out to a broad spectrum of support in Plaid because of this set of values and skills.
"Yes, she is a socialist. But in addition, she is a liberal and believes in the power of communities and local democracy" Don't think Leanne would describe herself as a liberal. But her commitment to communities is unquestioned.
ReplyDeleteAbove all other of leanne's outstanding qualities, for me, her background in a non-Welsh speaking working class family in the Rhondda is the one that is going to allow us to make the breakthrough in the Labour heartlands that we have to do if we are to achieve the independence that we all want. I know that you can't help your background, and leanne is lucky rather than skilful in this respect, but with all respect, all the other candidates are all a bit middle class, and a bit Welshie for the valleys to embrace them as they will leanne.
ReplyDelete