The Cost of English in a bilingual Wales

One of the things that I have found interesting about the Western Mail's attack week feature on the Welsh Language is how they conflate bilingualism with excessive support for the Welsh Language.

A perfect example of this can be found in the support for the paper's anti Welsh attitude garnered from Paul Murphy: who warns against 'excessive' spending on Welsh language schemes!

The very word bilingual suggests something to do with TWO languages so any perceived cost of bilingualism should, surely, be shared between BOTH languages. A monolingual transcript of Assembly proceedings, in either language, would have a price tag attached. So how much of the £400K bilingual waste of money is actually being spent on JUST the Welsh Language?

Does English come free of charge?

However I am willing to agree with the Western Mail, translation costs money and in these straightened times money is short. When witnesses appear before committees of the Assembly and present their evidence in Welsh, or when members address those committees in Welsh, translations are a waste of money; they are unneeded and cost too much; after all those of us who can understand Welsh can sacrifice that wasteful spending on English in order to put that wasted money into more worthy pots! Translating those contributions into English is expensive, a waste of money and shouldn't be allowed!

I have attended many hundreds of bilingual meetings in Wales during the past forty years, without ever using any translation facility – as a fluent user of both Welsh and English I don't need translators – those who need the translation facilities are the mono-linguist English, not us bilingual Welsh speakers!

Translation, in Wales, is primarily, spending on the English Language!

What is Fluency in Welsh?

This post was going to be a comment on a post on the National Left blog but has grown too long.

The background is that on Tuesday the Welsh Language Board issued a report that claimed that the number of Fluent Welsh speakers was declining by about 3,000 per year despite the fact that the 2001 and probably the 2011 census results have / will show an overall increase in the numbers of Welsh speakers. If rumours are correct the 2011 census will show that Welsh is now spoken by slightly more than was the case forty years ago in 1971.

The Welsh Language Board claims that the census increases might give false optimism for the fate of the language because heads of households might think that because their offspring do Welsh in school that they are more capable in the language than is practically true, so the census results are very subjective.

I agree.

The problem with the WLB's report is that it is also based on self reporting and is probably as subjective as the Census results. Many first language Welsh speakers feel that their Welsh isn't good enough, despite the fact that they use the language naturally and properly on a daily basis, so they don't declare themselves as fluent.

A few years ago I was in a pub in Llanrwst where two women were complaining to me about an advert for a job in a local retirement home being advertised as one where an ability to speak Welsh is essential. They thought that this unfairly discriminated against them because they were prohibited from applying for the job. The complaint was made in very down to earth colloquial Welsh. When I asked them what the problem was they both replied that our Welsh isn't good enough! They didn't perceive themselves as matching the WLB's fluency threshold, despite being native Welsh speakers!

For us to be able to measure how the language is fairing and in order to enhance its use we need a much more objective way of measuring language skills than either the Census or the WLB's surveys!

I live in a village where the 2001 Census claims that about 35% of the villagers speak Welsh.

I can make a case that puts this as a gross underestimation. I suspect that around 90% of my neighbours understand and use Welsh terms such as "croeso", "bore da", "iechyd da", "paned", "Ysgol", "Ysbyty" etc daily. They know how to spell Betws y Coed, and live in streets called Ffordd---, Rhes---, Bryn---, Maes--- know how to pronounce them properly and know their meaning – I think that such people should be encouraged to consider themselves as Welsh Speakers, as owners of the language and stakeholders in its future.

I could also make the case that the 35% is a gross over exaggeration. I very much doubt that 35% of the villagers actually converse in Welsh on a daily basis, feel comfortable speaking Welsh or would prefer to speak Welsh rather than English.

We can't have an objective assessment that covers everybody in Wales, but a generic Welsh in the Workplace qualification which ranges from the greeting knowledge that 90% have at level one to the specialist proofreading knowledge that perhaps 1% have at level 7, that tells the people of Wales when the Welsh that they know is good enough and encourages them to improve on it might be a step in the right direction.

Two faced Bryant

Chris Bryant MP's reaction to Roger Lewis' vicious attack on the Welsh:

"I can't believe Jonathan Edwards has risen to the bait," says Chris Bryant, Labour MP for Rhondda in South Wales. "Roger Lewis's piece is fatuous nonsense, but the last thing people want is a moaning version of Welsh nationalism. Wales is at its best when it is triumphantly insouciant about the criticism of others, and if we can't take a bit of scabrous attack without running to the police, it's a sad day for Wales."

Chris Bryant MP's reaction to Alun Cairns silly comment about the Italian football team:

Rhondda Labour MP Chris Bryant said: “David Cameron has had over two months to decide whether or not Alun Cairns should be sacked as the Tory candidate in the Vale of Glamorgan. “It’s very much decision time for David Cameron on this issue.
“Failing to sack Alun Cairns shows how indecisive Cameron really is when it comes to taking tough decisions.”

Sack somebody for making an ill informed joke about the Italians, but laugh off a scurrilous attack on the Welsh!

Typical Welsh Labour MP!

Peter Black Says that Welsh Language Campaigner is "Not right in the Head"

Before Mr Black sends his libel lawyers after me I hasten to say that

1 Peter Black has NEVER made such a claim

and

2 If he goes ahead with his support of Google Translate to translate the Cofnod (the official proceedings of the Assembly) he wouldn't have a legal leg to stand on, because Google Translate undoubtedly translates a recent comment made by him as accusing a language campaigner of being Not right in the Head (nad yw'n ddim yn iawn pen).

Not right in the head, especially in the south Wales dialect, suggests severe brain damage He hasn't been right in the head since the pit ceiling come down on him.

Wrongheaded, however is a much more benign term that just means contrary to sound judgment

The difference between the two terms is a subtlety that only a human translator can differentiate at the moment, and Google failed to spot the difference!

If Peter and friends decide to go down the Google route to translate the Cofnod I can guarantee that myself and others will pick up these nuances of translation and use them with glee come the next Assembly Election!

Do users of the English language in the Assembly really want to risk giving those of us who can spot the nuances our field day, by insisting on a machine generated bilingual record?

Using Welsh by Blogging

The latest addition to my Blog List is Everyday Welsh. I will let the blogger explain what the blog is for:

Right, to begin, I would like firstly to explain (briefly) my intentions for this blog.

This blog should NOT be used as your PRIMARY source for learning Welsh.

I assume, that any visitors here have already delved somewhat into the beautiful language and know at least some basics. My goal is to IMMERSE you in modern/essential Welsh culture, current Welsh culture! Therefore, I have decided to aid all of your learning by teaching aspects of the language through Videos/Music etc. Short, engaging clips that you SHOULD watch OVER & OVER... and with my help you WILL come to UNDERSTAND their meanings.

I set the idea out, knowing that this EXPOSURE to Welsh IS very beneficial. Studies have been conducted PROVING that exposure to the target language (i.e. Welsh in this case) improves language acquisition, or, the rate it will take you to grasp the language. Although incomprehensible initially, YOU WILL start to know the media clips on this site WELL. You therefore will have a REPOSITORY or a WELL of available vocab etc. you can SQUEEZE into your conversations!!

One point I would like to stress.... ENJOY the clips! Have fun! Don't worry if you don't understand at first... YOU WILL BE ABLE TO. Good, so... relaxed?

I wish all the best to "Everyday Welsh". It is an interesting addition to Welsh learning facilities and I hope that it succeeds in its mission.

Not Covered?

From the Conservative Party Manifesto's Welsh Language Policy:

(We will) Create a Bilingual Nation – Introduce a Charter-Mark for businesses which will recognise Welsh language services. The scheme will be voluntary but will offer incentives for bilingual signage and Welsh language training for front-line staff.

As kitchen staff aren't front line and Carreg Môn doesn't appear to be a willing volunteer, what suport do the Tories offer these Welsh speaking workers?

Democracy Live and the Welsh Language

The new BBC Service Democracy Live is great and one that I am sure to use often. It offers live and recorded debates from eight UK parliamentary chambers, including the Assembly's Senedd.

It is also possible to embed proceedings from the chamber into blog posts. As the service is available it must be used!

Here is the discussion on the Welsh language eLCO held yesterday:



(NB the embedded video audio comes from translators for most of the debate)


Apparently it is posssible to take individual contributions out of full debates for the sake of partisan or personal embedding, but I haven't worked out how to do that yet. However, this is a debate worth following from beginning to end.

What I find heartening about this debate is the fact that its liveliness, the fire in the belly, the party political point scoring and the passion is based on an argument about which party is the greatest supporter and promoter of the language.

Listening to Tory and Liberal Democrat and Labour members criticising a Plaid Cymru minister for compromising on the language and not doing enough to defend it bought a tear to the eye; not because the criticisms might, or might not, be justified - but just because they were made.

A quarter of a century, or less, ago this sort of debate would have involved a powerless member of Plaid stuck in a corner supporting the language whilst the other three parties ravaged him or her for the stupidity of advancing the cause of a half dead language. The fact that today, a nationalist minister had to fight off attacks from members of the other parties who were falling over themselves to prove that they are the most ardent supporters and truest defenders of the language is evidence of how far the Welsh language cause has moved in so short a time.

Plaid's next big challenge is to get to a situation where all the other parties are criticising it for not doing enough to advance the cause of national self determination :-)

The Poll that got away

This is a bit of a late post. It relates to a story that was a big news item on the BBC's Radio Cymru and S4C news bulletins on Monday and was for a time the lead story on BBC Arlein.

I haven't mentioned it because I expected that it would also appear in the English MSM, on BBC Wales, ITV, The Western Mail or the Daily Post. But no! This appears to be a story that only Welsh speakers are interested in according to the MSM

A survey carried out by Beufort polled more than 1000 people in Wales. Only 11% of respondents considered themselves to be fluent Welsh speakers.

BUT

76% of them said that they thought that it is important for companies to advertise their services and wares in the Welsh Language.

82% of respondents said that the Welsh language is something to be proud of.

Why wasn't this story considered to be of interest to non Welsh speaking listeners and viewers of BBC and ITV Wales news programmes or readers of the Daily Post, the Western Mail or the Echo?

Would it be naughty to suggest that the editors prefere language conflict issues to dominate their coverage rather than to report the fact that most Welsh people, regardless of linguistic ability, support and value the Welsh Language as one of our national treasures?

How Dare He!?

Guardian Arts Corespondent Charlotte Higgins is upset, very upset. Like all Guardianistas she is all for diversity - but sometimes things can go too far! Things like the National Assembly of Wales' Minister for Culture and the Welsh Language speaking Welsh in the National Assembly Building during a concert performed by the Welsh National Orchestra! Clearly not an appropriate situation in which to use the Welsh Language.

How dare he? Shocking Behaviour! - Shouldn't be allowed - sack the ignorant hick. If this sort of insulting attitude towards the English Language is allowed to go unchecked in Cardiff where might it lead? - Italian operas in Glyndebourne? German in Covent Garden? Outrageous!

HT Victoria

The £444,000,000 rip off

If you click on this link, you will find a copy of a typical England and Wales Court Summons. In this case it is a Witness Summons for the Court of Protection relating to people detained under the Mental Health Act. The form is a simple template where one needs to fill in the boxes.

Its fair to say that there are many hundreds of different versions of summons forms, for different levels of court and different statuses of those who are summonsed to attend. But they are all basically similar, they are all simple templates. Three quarters of the details on all of the different templates ask for similar basic information NAME ............. Address............ Date, Place and Time of hearing etc.

Using the Court of Protection form and just fiddling with the very basic programmes that I have on my computer I was able to create a template, a Welsh translation of the template and the ability to automatically fill both forms at once in less than half an hour.

I am not a computer expert, I have no training, I have taught myself to do what I want to do on a computer by trial and error. But if I am able to create a form filling application in two languages in less than half an hour (albeit for just one form) why on earth is the Libra system being delivered in an incomplete state 7 years late and at a cost of £444 Million?

The system is incomplete because it can't offer Welsh & English bilingual summonses. Rectifying this problem is going to cost another £4 million.

Facebook was translated into Welsh by a group of about a dozen volunteers over a period of six months or so. Facebook, one would imagine, is a more complex system than a simple form filling exercise. If those volunteers offered to translate Libra their work would be valued at about £300,000 each! If those volunteers were to produce a virtual invoice for the cost of translating Facebook I doubt if they would come close to even 2% of what Libra claims the translation costs will be.

The whole Libra project raises rip-off questions. But the £4 million translation cost raises even more worries. £4 million for a single Welsh Translation service is manna from heaven to the anti-Welsh language lobby, it is a gift to those who want excuses for not supporting the language. As an avid supporter of the language I can think of much better language support uses for such a huge amount of money than issuing summonses - how many language tutors and learners could be supported by such a sum?

I'm not sure how or by whom Welsh Language projects should be investigated - but this is a project in need of a very serious investigation!

Why Just a Welsh Language LCO?

A number of posts last week across the Welsh blogosphere relating to the Welsh Language LCO attracted comments from Brian Barker from the UK Esperanto Lobby.

I have never quite understood the idea of Esperanto, and have never favoured the idea of "one universal language". However Mr Barker's comments in favour of a legal status for Esperanto do raise an interesting point regarding Language issues and the Assembly. Specifically, why should the Assembly request competence for just the Welsh Language?

Wales is a multi cultural, multi linguistic community. The idea that the National Assembly should have authority to legislate and make policies in regard to just ONE of those many languages doesn't seem right to me.

Many of those who object to any protection for the Welsh language worry that such protection is, in some way, going to force them to learn Welsh or disadvantage them because they don't speak Welsh.

Most Welsh speakers despair when we hear such arguments. We know what linguistic disadvantage is and we know that giving our language a legal status is not going to endanger the future of English in Wales! However, we have to accept that the worries of the non Welsh speaking community, despite being unfounded, are genuine worries.

Competence for Language, rather than just the Welsh Language could enable the Assembly to give the English speaking majority assurances that would enable them to support the protection of Welsh without fear.

Wales doesn't have just two indigenous languages - it has three. Since its inception the Assembly has accepted that BSL (sign language) is the third most commonly used indigenous language in Wales. The Assembly is the only government body that accepts BSL as an official native language. A language LCO that gave the Assembly authority over BSL as well as Welsh might make ITV Wales think again about ditching BSL on it's news programmes.

In some wards in Wales both English and Welsh are minority languages, the Assembly should have the language competency to cope with these communities, and to react to their linguistic needs sensitively. An exclusive Welsh language LCO doesn't give our government the tools needed for that job!

I don't think that the current Welsh Language LCO can be adapted into a general Language LCO, given its passage. But whilst the current competence order is going through its paces, it would be good if the Assembly started to think about other broader linguistic responsibilities it could aquire as the next step!

That Chippy in Chepstow

The ability to pass legislation regarding the Welsh language already exists!

The willingness to pass such legislation also exists - Westminster has passed decenial Welsh Language Laws since the 1930's.

The Welsh Language LCO has sod all to do with whether the Chippy in Chepstow should be subject to Welsh Language Legislation - it is all to do with who should decide whether or not said chippy should be subject to said legislation!

The Welsh Language LCO has nothing to do with the rights or the wrongs of Welsh language provision, it's to do with which institution is best placed to decide linguistic issues: Westminster or the Bay?

Those of us who want competence for the language to be decided in the Assembly, rather than at Westminster, are actually taking a gamble. Any Assembly language measures are going to be scrutinised a damn site more closely than Westminster measures are.

In Westminster the Welsh Language is always a side issue. Something that an enthusiastic Minister or Civil Servant can get away with.

The Education Act of 1993 insists that all pupils in Wales (including the Chippy in Chepstow's kids) are educated up to key stage three in Welsh! I doubt if such legislation could ever have passed through a Welsh Assembly given the competence to debate it!

There is one thing that worries me about the language LCO, which relates to the whole LCO process, and may be relevant to other LCO's.

If partial legislative responsibility is given to the Assembly, and partial legislative responsibility is left with Westminster then substantial responsibility can be left in limbo with neither body taking responsibility for it - the worst of both worlds.

Even if you couldn't give a fig about the Language, imagine the distress that limiting an LCO could cause in child protection legislation, leaving the differences between the Bay and Westminster in limbo!

The housing LCO compromise leaves neither Cardiff nor Westminster fully responsible for social housing - social housing will slip between both stools now - and probably die!

The worst thing that could happen to the language is Westminster giving 25% of language protection responsibility to the Assembly, and using that 25% as an excuse to do nothing with the 75% retained responsibility.

My personal attitude is either Wales gets 100% responsibility over Welsh Language issues, which common sense says that Wales should have, or we tell Westminster to stick the LCO where the sun don't shine!

What is Plaid Cymru For?

There use to be a time when Plaid Cymru was the party that one could expect to defend local communities. Now it is a party that closes local facilities such as schools and public conveniences and shouts down and swears at those who offer solutions that might help save services.

It use to be a party that supported the Welsh Language, but since being in government they have renegade on some promises made to support the language and failed to deliver on others. They even voted against a proposal to establish a Welsh Language Commissioner.

Plaid use to be a party that supported self government for Wales, but according to the Western Mail Speaking as a Plaid Assembly Member and a former leader of the party Dafydd Elis Thomas says that he is opposed to a referendum on further powers for the Assembly untill well after 2011. Indeed this mam who vociferously opposed the 40% threshold imposed by Labour in 1979 is now opposed to further self government unless it is clear that at least 60% of voters support further powers.

If Plaid doesn't defend local communities, doesn't deliver on the language and doesn't campaign for further self government is there any reason for the party's continuing existence?

Welsh-athon Challenge

I Found this challenge on Facebook, it sounds like an interesting way of encouraging people to learn Welsh and of of giving those who have started learning the language during new academic year an extra boost to their studies. On the other hand learning a new language can be a very stressful experience, would adding a semi-political and charitable goal add to the stress in a negative way?

Ever fancied learning Welsh? Ever fancied raising lots of cash for your favourite charity? Would doing one, convince you to do the other?

Then take up the challenge of learning Welsh to fluency before the 2011 census, (so you can proudly proclaim you speak Welsh on the next census return), and get yourself sponsored for the challenge, seeing how much money you can raise for your favourite charity! :o)

Our goal is:-
RAISING WELSH SPEAKERSHIP BY 2011 & RAISING FUNDS FOR EXCELLENT CAUSES!

Anyone could do it, but it's a BIG CHALLENGE! Here are the 10 steps you have to take:-

1. Select an excellent charity you wish to support (perhaps a Welsh one?)

2. Gain as much sponsorship as possible for your charity for the following challenge:-

"I challenge myself to become a fluent Welsh-speaker by the 2011 U.K. Census!"

(If you already speak a little Welsh, you only have to convince your sponsors that the challenge of becoming fluent is a big one! (Clearly it is - it's as arduous a challenge as any marathon, but thankfully you don't have to be physically fit!) If you have a head start in your learning, perhaps you could start your challenge later in the course of the event.)

3. (The difficult bit) LEARN WELSH TO FLUENCY, before the month prior to the 2011 Census, when you will have to prove your achievement! The challenge is possible within the two years study time available!

4. Don't learn alone - network with other 2011 WELSH-ATHON participants, share learning ideas, and learn together! Also please see the resources for learning Welsh that will be uploaded to 2011 WELSH-AHTON sites, as well as tips and recommended courses.

5. Attend the/an official 2011 WELSH-ATHON exam where your fluency will be tested - one month before the census is conducted - you'll be expected to translate the front page of the Welsh language daily newspaper "Y BYD,"[*] or a selected article from a Welsh language magazine, under exam conditions.

6. Notify the 2011 WELSH-ATHON reporters of how much you've raised, and what your chosen charity was, after passing the exam, so the success of the challenge can be reported by the Welsh media!

7. Attend the post-exam party, where people will be celebrating their newly learned Welsh, and how much they've raised for so many excellent causes!

8. Submit the funds you have raised to your selected charity!!!

9. Proudly indicate your ability to speak Welsh on your 2011 census return! :o)

10. Find out how many people can speak Welsh in Wales after the Census results are published, and enjoy the Welsh you've learned for the rest of your life, encouraging others by telling them how you succeeded in the challenge!

SURELY, IT'S THE MOST PATRIOTIC CHARITY SPONSORSHIP CHALLENGE A WELSH FUND-RAISER COULD FIND IN A LIFETIME!

The Facebook group is here Facebook Welshathon. Those who do not have a Facebook account can contact the organisers on

[* Challenge 5 needs updating!!!]

Our English Identity

This a translation of an item on BBC Cymru ar lein's web page. As far as I can find it has not been published in English anywhere and it has not been followed up by BBC Cymru on TV or radio news bulletins.

The Welsh Language Board has asked the British Government to reconsider after they refused to ensure that the Welsh Language appears on ID cards.

The first cards will be issued to foreign nationals from next November.

The British Government said that they didn't intend to use Welsh on the cards because it is not one of the Official Languages of the European Union.

Meri Huws, chair of The Welsh Language Board said that the response from the Home Office isn't good enough.

"In our opinion, the reason given isn't sufficient" as Welsh is already used on passports under the same European directives.

"We believe that ID cards for Wales should be bilingual, as is the case with driving licences".

The Government has stated that they expect that all citizens will be offered the cards within three years.

It will be necessary for all airport staff to have the cards by next year
After that it is expected that the card will be offered to young people over 16 years and then to the rest of the population.

This is an interesting development. Although I have no particular beef against ID cards, I suspect that most politically active supporters of the Welsh language oppose them. This seems like a cynical ploy to get Plaid Cymru / pro-Welsh language suporters who are members of other political parties/ Cymdeithas yr Iaith even the Assembly to campaign FOR Welsh ID cards rather than opposing ID cards per say.

A cheap shot, which just shows what a dinosaur Cymdeithas Cledwyn is up against in trying to persuade people that the Labour party isn't pathologically against the Welsh Language

OU does Welsh

Those with an interest in things Welsh wishing to further their education might be interested in two new foundation courses being offered by the Open University

Croeso: beginners' Welsh
Points: 30 Code: L196 Level: 1

Croeso will give you the skills you need to speak and understand simple Welsh in everyday situations. No previous knowledge of Welsh is required. We’ll send you printed and audio materials, and you’ll have a dedicated website, all of which support your language learning. And while you’re learning Welsh, you’ll gain a real feel for Welsh culture too.

Small country, big history: themes in the history of Wales
Points: 15 Code: A182 Level: 1

How does a country without political independence gain an identity? What is the role of history and historians in shaping national memory and identity? How have the historians of Wales done their work – what are their sources, and how should we scrutinise them? Using case studies ranging from the impact of Tom Jones and the Welsh rugby team in the twentieth century, to the building of Welsh castles under Edward I, this course will develop your understanding of Welsh history, the craft of the historian, and some of the ways in which national identities are formed.

Taking these courses will not only give you points towards a degree, but will also enable you to have learned conversations about Tom Jones and rugby in Welsh - wow the benefits of a good education ;-)